Work Relief Administration Press Conferences
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Press Conference
Howard 0. Hunter
September 26, 1941
3:00 P.M.

Mr. Hunter:	The WPA is really getting out of the news these days.
Press:	Yes, too much war.
Mr. Hunter:	I would like to confront on a couple of things in regard to WPA employment and unemployment figures. This last week the WPA had the lowest total employment it has had since the beginning—1,034,629. That is over all, including Puerto Rico. There are now in round figures 5,300,000 unemployed. That is the August figure. That is the figure for the first time released by the WPA—the WPA figure, secured by the Research Division on a sample count we have been experimenting with for over a year. The technique for arriving at that figure has been discussed with all government departments and particularly with the three organizations which have, in the past, estimated unemployment—CIO, AF of L and the National Industrial Conference Board, all of which have agreed that our technique in arriving at that figure is good. I think that is the best figure. I predict that that figure will go down this month materially and begin to rise in November and sharply increase in December and January.
Query:	January and February are generally the worst, aren't they?
Mr. Hunter:	They have been in the past. I predict an increase in unemployment will be created by the defense program itself. The increase in unemployment is largely due to non-defense industries—The WPA has not estimated what that increase will be but guesses are one to three million by different agencies. The National Association of Manufacturers estimates that the retail industries affected by priorities will involve some three million employees. I think that figure was the highest rather than the lowest. It is possible we might be called upon to increase WPA employment during the winter. I wouldn't think any increase would be necessary before December, and if it occurs, it will be due to the so-called priorities unemployment and will affect us in two ways—We would be called upon either to increase employment on WPA projects or to increase the training program. There are too generally different types of unemployment occuring in Detroit which we hope will be temporary, whereby people dropped from the automobile industry could go on defense work. Those people should, within a reasonable short time, get other jobs. The other groups which would not lead to defense industries—I see nothing but unemployment insurance or WPA employment for such towns.
Query:	Have you any estimate as to the possible unemployment in Michigan—as a result of the definitely known curtailment?
Mr. Hunter:	The WPA will have a very good estimate within two weeks because we have a good research field staff gathering information. On Detroit I would estimate about 100,000.
Query:	You mention 100,000 additional unemployed in Detroit. Do you have it for the rest of the country?
Mr. Hunter:	No.
Query:	As a result of priorities?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes, because the big production decrease I understand will be in December. mere is this factor—This is not official, just commenting on it. There are several of the large motor plants in Detroit which have defense contracts that are actually building plants to carry out those contracts in other places than Detroit. They are Buick and Studebaker—The thing may be very dislocated.
Query:	Here about four months ago when they were starting the new General motors plant I asked the Army why didn't they put it in Flint and they said Flint is already too crowded and there was no possibility in finding homes for the workers.
Mr. Hunter:	What I would like to do would be to increase the training program, that is to do what we are now actually doing in WPA, and to pay a security wage to employees in training.
Query:	What type workers did you say you have no hope for except unemployment benefits?
Mr. Hunter:	There are a number of smaller communities which depend upon one major industry and if that industry is forced to close down or can't get materials, there isn't anything for those people to get in the way of defense employment unless they move to some other town, which I imagine a good many would do.
Query:	People that are dropped by automobile companies—wouldn't they take little training to fit then for defense?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes, very little. Their problem would be simpler than any other group. It would take very little retraining in that case.
Query:	Are you giving special attention to small one-industry towns?
Mr. Hunter:	We are watching that very closely—that hasn't really happened yet. There is still speculation. I don't know of any competent economist here who doesn't predict there will be a substantial amount of it, but actually there is not very much yet. We have our field staff cooperating with employment surveys in each state watching that very closely. We will get reports within twenty-four hours of any reductions in employment in any one locality.
Query:	This 1,034,000—that includes your direct aid people and your training people under the training program too?
Mr. Hunter:	That is right. The training program itself has about 50,000 people but the turnover is rapid.
Query:	what do you think is the maximum you could bring your rolls to within the winter? The President said to keep it within a million.
Mr. Hunter:	If that occurs on a large scale, we would have to reopen that discussion with Congress.
Query:	What is your appropriation?
Mr. Hunter:	$875,000,000. We take the position we are not going to make any direct increase unless the priorities unemployment actually happens.
Query:	But if the problem gets bad enough, you will ask Congress for more money?
Mr. Hunter:	We will do one of two things—We can increase employment and inform Congress and run out of money before the end of the fiscal year or ask for a deficiency appropriation in advance of the increase.
Query:	During this low period, are you able to spend sufficiently less during this period to make up for more you may have to spend in the three bad months?
Mr. Hunter:	No, I do not think so. At the same time we are employing the smallest number of people—the percentage of the total people that are eligible—We have about 1,250,000 people now eligible for WPA in addition to those we are now employing. The second factor under consideration is an increase in WPA wages due to the increased cost in living, particularly as it affects WPA workers.
Query:	You say you are considering increasing wages?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes, we are discussing that now and will arrive at a decision within a couple of weeks. I think we will, in all probability, increase wages. The weekly wages for manufacturing industries increased 32%—the hourly wages 15%—the WPA wage schedule remained the same. On the basis of the so-called security wage, it is low enough anyhow.
Query:	What wage has gone up 15%?
Mr. Hunter:	Hourly wage rates—actually weekly industrial wage rates have increased 32% since the middle of 1939, about two years ago. Now the general overall cost of living index has increased. 7 1/2% in that same time. The retail food price increase is 15% and that is the main item in the WPA wage—food and clothing. Having based the security wage on the very minimum anyway, I think we are justified and should consider an increase in the WPA wage—at least at the same ratio to the cost of food, clothing and rent.
Query:	That is what you have in mind, rather than an increase in the industrial wage?
Mr. Hunter:	Exactly.
Query:	What are the wages now?
Mr. Hunter:	We have several classifications in the different geographical areas—they run from a minimum of $31.00 in the South to a high of $94.00 in the North. We can give you the entire range on that.
Query:	You say that the weekly industrial pay rolls have gone up 32%?
Mr. Hunter:	No, the weekly wages per persons—the number of dollars per week they get.
Query:	32% since 1939?
Mr. Hunter:	In that connection this price control legislation is very important to WPA and other low income groups. I would think you could probably say we will increase wages in the next 30 days.
Query:	I think it is fair to say that you folks in WPA are on top on this priorities employment as far as General Motors in Michigan. You knew this was coming?
Mr. Hunter:	I think it is perfectly fair to say that we know more about unemployment than any other agency—We have been watching this very closely for seven years.
Query:	You knew that was coming before a lot of people. I was wondering if you have definite plans lined up for relieving that situation in Michigan.
Mr. Hunter:	I don't thinly we could relieve it there without relieving it in other states.
Query:	You have a one-industry state there.
Mr. Hunter:	On the other hand, in the western part of Michigan there will be a great number of plants closed down entirely. Those plants making parts for refrigerators, washing machines, I don't know whether they can retool for defense contracts or not.
Query:	Could you tell us about any of your plans in meeting the situation in Michigan?
Mr. Hunter:	The plan I would use in the main in the Detroit area would be a short period of training or retraining for people employed in the automobile industry, assuming the money is available. In other parts of the state where plants are closed down and would not secure defense contracts, our only plan would be to give them a WPA job on a project.
Query:	What do you mean by the Detroit area?
Mr. Hunter:	The motor area.
Query:	The whole state of Michigan with the exception of perhaps Muskegon and Grand Rapids is the motor area.
Mr. Hunter:	Our plan involves two things. One is to train where there is a chance to get a job in a defense plant if it opens up or a WPA job, if it doesn't.
Query:	Have you any tentative quotas?
Mr. Hunter:	No, I do not think it will hit very heavily until December, not on any large scale.
Query:	Is your plan now to increase the rolls where it is necessary to take care of this situation?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes.
Query:	If you do not go to Congress first are you going to be like Teddy Roosevelt with his Navy around the world? You are going to spend the money and let Congress worry about it later?
Mr. Hunter:	I am going to play fair with Congress and inform them before doing so.
Query:	If the need arises you plan to increase the rolls regardless of that stipulation of a million?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes, because I think it is too important for the total defense of the country to allow any large number of people to be thrown out of jobs, on account of the defense program itself. If it only involved two or three hundred thousand people, that would not be so serious, but the lowest figure is a million and ranges from two to three million—three million, I believe, is nearer right. For instance, if you drop 100,000 people in the motor industry in Detroit, that is not all that are involved in that drop. There are salesmen, service men in garages, supply dealers, etc.
Query:	Unless I missed something, you said three million a minute ago—was that an estimate of three million out of employment?
Mr. Hunter:	I said the estimates of the various agencies run from one to three million additional unemployment due to priorities. We have not made an official estimate but will do so within the next few weeks.
Query:	Your appropriation is $875,000,000 this year. That is down from what it was last year?
Mr. Hunter:	It was about $1,375,000,000.
Query:	You are sure now from the present situation you will have to ask Congress for more money?
Mr. Hunter:	I would not like to say I am sure, but I think so.
Query:	How long is this $875,000,000 supposed to last?
Mr. Hunter:	Unti1 July 1st of next year.
Query:	How long do you think it likely to last?
Mr. Hunter:	I do not like to estimate the figure—I would like to wait and see what happens. There were a lot of estimates that there would be no steel shortage, no aluminum shortage, no transportation problems, no unemployment caused by priorities. I think they are going to be in the sane boat they were on other estimates.
Query:	This whole business of from one to three million concerns priorities unemployed?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes, due to that. That doesn't mean that particular individuals may not get jobs. I think a lot will.
Query:	In addition you have to figure on the normal rise in unemployment that always occurs in the winter?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes, seasonal unemployment.
Query:	If the WPA pay roll would increase about 15%—
Mr. Hunter:	I think probably 10% would be a better guess. Most of the WPA workers get a little break on food because of the food stamp plan.
Query:	Have you any machinery in the WPA whereby you can take a group of workers thrown out of a plant in Wisconsin and move them to Illinois to work?
Mr. Hunter:	No, except that we furnish our information to the OPM. We have no facilities for arranging to move workers from one place to another. We do however, in our New Division of Training and Reemployment have a service ourselves whereby we work with the State Employment Service in securing jobs. For instance, if there were 100,000 WPA workers in July who got off WPA to take private jobs, of that 100,000, 50,000 got off by themselves and got jobs, about 7,000 got a job through the State Employment Service, and something over 40,000 we got the jobs for them through our contacts with private industries and business agencies. That was a pretty good turnover and obviously the highest we have ever had in percentage. We are faced with the requirement in the Act that we have to take back anybody who leaves to take a private job. I expect that in October we will have a substantial number returning from agricultural employment that we automatically have to take on WPA, which means that we have to increase the total or fire that many people in order to replace them on jobs. This is the first year that has been a serious problem as always at this time we have started increasing. The theory this year was that we would not have to do it because defense work would keep going up. Probably the best thing we have done is this training program and the in-plant program is receiving a very good reception. We have put people in 266 plants in the country—we pay their wages. It is a maximum of eight weeks and it takes the fellow about two and one-half weeks to get the job and the maximum of those people have gotten full-time jobs.
Query:	Won't it be longer retraining some of these automobile common laborers? It won't be a problem with the skilled machine men but it will be with the laborers. You really have to train them—
Mr. Hunter:	I would think so. I don't know the particular kind of jobs that will be available. Michigan has this break—they have a good unemployment compensation set up, one of the best in the country, which will take care of them. It moves fast, people get their money out faster.
Query:	You say that the transfer of women to defense employment is expected to increase? Mr. McNutt said that one third of the defense jobs were those women could do and he seemed to imply that manufacturers were not very receptive to the idea—To what extent are you putting women in these jobs?
Mr. Hunter:	I would agree with Mr. McNutt. There are not many manufacturers willing to accept women in defense industries.
Query:	What is the attitude of the labor unions on that?
Mr. Hunter:	A little suspicious. If you want to get a list of the plants where we do have women, I will get it for you.
Query:	The wage scales now in effect have been in effect how long?
Mr. Hunter:	Just about two years since the Act of July 1, 1939; practically no change. They were changed in July, 1939, because of a provision in the Act which required us to re-establish wage scales so that there would be no greater differences in the different parts of the country than in the cost of living.
Query:	In that same time the industrial wages have gone up 32%?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes. There is another report you might want. On defense employment we have 334,000 people out of 1,034,000 on defense projects. Those include in addition to airports, roads and other construction projects some 36,000 people out of the 330,000 who are on projects certified as National Defense importance such as literacy training for draftees. The Selective Service has hounded us until we finally agreed to give literacy training to people that the Army won't accept because they cannot read and write. Some 90,000, principally in the Southern states.
Query:	90,000 have been rejected?
Mr. Hunter:	They have not been rejected. They passed up to the final physical examination, but were held up by the literacy test. They are only obliged to have a fourth grade education.
Query:	You mean for Army service?
Mr. Hunter:	We have agreed to teach them to read and write.
Query:	But you have a special project to teach boys who have been rejected in the draft because they couldn't pass the literacy test and you have 90,000 prospective students down south?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes. We also have as certified to defense importance a citizenship training program for the benefit of aliens.
Query:	Where will you operate these literacy schools?
Mr. Hunter:	We operate anywhere.
Query:	Why don't they just go to the public schools?
Mr. Hunter:	The people are twenty-one to twenty-eight years of age—
Query:	Probably too big for the chairs.
Mr. Hunter:	They are only required to have the equivalent of a fourth grade education, and I don't think they would like to go to a fourth grade school. We have operated a number of literacy classes for a number of years and have already taught over a million people to read and write on WPA projects, and 90,000 more wouldn't be too much of a bite to take.
Query:	The south isn't the only place you found people who couldn't read and write, was it?
Mr. Hunter:	No, but the heaviest load was there.
Query:	How about the citizenship program, have you started on that?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes.
Query:	I mean this new one. They are making such talk about Dean Russell.
Mr. Hunter:	Dean Russell has his organization set up in forty states now.
Query:	What are you doing?
Mr. Hunter:	We are providing the teachers and the Immigration Service of the Department of Justice is the sponsor and puts up some of the money.
Query:	Does that come out of the $875,000,000?
Mr. Hunter:	To the extent of paying wages for teachers. There is a limitation on the project of twelve million.
Query:	You do not have to pay that?
Mr. Hunter:	No.
Mr. Felt:	I think six is in addition to that.
Mr. Hunter:	Twelve million is what we put as a limitation on that.
Mr. Phillips:	Fourteen.
Mr. Hunter:	That may last well over a year, it will depend on how many schools and teachers we have.
Query:	Then you put a limitation of how much?
Mr. Hunter:	I said twelve million but I have been corrected. It is fourteen million.
Query:	What has that got to do with unemployment?
Mr. Hunter:	The teachers.
Query:	I don't see why they should make you pay that out of an unemployment appropriation.
Mr. Hunter:	All we pay is the teachers' salaries. We hire unemployed teachers in the main to do the Work—we don't pay students anything at all.
Query:	Are there that many unemployed teachers?
Mr. Hunter:	We have had as many at one time as 25,000 teachers certified as in need. I think that is reduced a good deal now.
Query:	Did you know the Office of Education has reported a shortage of teachers and they are asking Selective Service to defer men teachers?
Mr. Hunter:	I understand that in some parts of the country—in the middle west—teachers are going into defense industries. What we do in giving priority to that program is to stop adult education projects and use those teachers on the literacy projects. It really isn't an increase of teachers. It may be a decrease, as with our big recreation project which Mr. McNutt is sponsoring.
Query:	This increase in pay, you actually plan to increase? Just a matter of deciding how much?
Mr. Hunter:	It might be a rather wild guess at this moment, but for the present the range is from $31 to $94.
Query:	Can you give an idea as to what the future range with the increase might be?
Mr. Hunter:	I am inclined to believe it would be a flat percentage over the whole scale. We are studying now whether it will be a flat percentage over the whole scale or larger for the lower and smaller for the upper. I think it would be an average of about 10% all the way along. I think it is justified even if it means slightly smaller total employment rather than try to spread starvation too thin. There is a 15% increase in food prices which means a lot of people aren't going to eat much.
Query:	You think it is better to increase the wages than to put more people on?
Mr. Hunter:	Yes, up to a certain point.
Query:	You said the increase in the retail food would be 15% and you only propose to raise wages 10% At least you are not providing for any luxuries.
Mr. Hunter:	That is right. At this point the conference adjourned. Reported by: Mrs. Bishop Mrs. Bonaventura Mrs. Flaherty