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Interview [with Mr. Gordon, of the Theater Union]

Percy Bleckman
May 1935

On Fourteenth Street near the Sixth Avenue "L" stands the Civic Repertory Theater, home of the Theater Union. It is an old building with a dirty grey complexion and is obviously in a down condition. Here I had come seeking an interview run I entered, and climbed the winding stairs to the office Could I see Mr. Gordon, the director? No, I did not want a job; I wanted an interview. He was on the stage? Thank you.

However, it seemed as if so busy a man as the director was not easily to be found. If he was not on the stage, I was told, he might be in the office, in the boxes, out for lunch, or not in yet. I was beginning to think that Mr. Gordon was a myth when I ran across an actor who seemed to know where he was at the moment. I followed my guide down a gloomy corridor; he stopped before a door through which music issued. We entered. I saw before me a young man in the process of squeezing a tune out of a piano-accordian. It couldn't be the busy— "This is Mr. Gordon", said my companion and disappeared.

Mr. Gordon rose and disentangling a hand from the accordian offered it to me in a firm handshake. He was a rather tall, well built young man with pleasing features and short cropped brown hair.

"How do you do?" he said. "Sit down and make yourself comfortable. After putting away his instrument, he turned to me and smiled. "Well, what can I do for you?"

"I am a representative of the Evander Childs High School literary magazine and I thought that since so much enthusiasm has been aroused by the Theater Union it would be timely and interesting to find out just what the Theater Union is and what its purpose is."

Mr. Gordon smiled again. "That's a rather large order."

"Well, will you tell me why the Theater Union was founded in the first place?"

Mr. Gordon thought for a moment. "At the present time," he se', the theater is intellectually, spiritually, and socially bankrupt. The Broadway theater appeals only to ten percent of the people and even this does not include the really cultured and educated people who are disgusted by the Broadway fare. There was a need for a theater to appeal to ninety percent of the people, which means the workers. This theater was to deal with social problems especially those confronting the workers."

Here I interrupted him. "You said, Mr. Gordon, that this theater should deal with the problems of the workers. But should it merely reflect the social conditions or seek to interpret them from some point of view?"

This time Mr. Gordon answered firmly and with no hesitation. "Decidedly, it should interpret the present from the workers' point of view. The Theater Union recognizes the fact that there is a constant economic struggle between the classes, that affects the entire life of the country. It seeks to interpret the problems that arise from this struggle, from the workers' point of view."

Meanwhile, I was writing furiously trying to keep up with him, and, wishing that I had taken shorthand in school. Mr. Gordon stopped to let me catch up with him. "Now, what else would you like to know?" asked the director as I finished writing.

"I think you have covered that angle quite thoroughly," I said, my fingers still aching. "But your last statement brings up another question. Since the main purpose of the workers' play is to take an active part in the struggles of the workers, will this not limit the scope of the play?"

Mr. Gordon leaned forward in his chair. "In the first place," he said, "you must bear in mind that the scope of the workers' play is no more limited than that of the bourgeois play. In both cases the scope is unlimited. Within the scope of the workers' theater there are countless themes and variations that can be used. The workers' theater merely reflects the ideology of the workers just as the bourgeois theater, consciously or unconsciously, reflects the ideology of the bourgeois."

Mr. Gordon paused. A loud voice from the adjoining room broke out in dialect. Mr. Gordon smiled. "He's one of the actors in our new play 'The Black Pit'," the director explained. "He is supposed to be a Polish miner. However, let's get back to the workers' theater."

"There is another point I should like to bring up," I commenced. "The workers' theater deals with contemporary plays. Do you think it has any place for the old classical playwrights like Shakespeare?"

Mr. Gordon thought for a moment. "That question would require clarification of the function of the workers' theater. A theater can have three functions. It can act as a recreational stimulus, as an emotional stimulus, or as a stimulus to action. The workers' theater acts as a stimulus to action. It is the only theater in America that treats of vital problems and tries to solve them. Since the best theater is that which best fulfils its function, I should say there is no place for Shakespeare in this type of theater."

Again Mr. Gordon paused to allow me to catch up to him.

"Now, Mr. Gordon," I said, "at the beginning of this interview you stated that the Broadway theater does not appeal to the really cultured and educated people. Is there any place in the workers' theater for a play written from the workers' viewpoint but appealing more to educated and cultured people?"

Mr. Gordon again thought deeply. "That is a difficult problem. We want to be as fully artistic as possible yet we must realize that the cultural level of America is very low compared to that of European countries, and that this level must be raised. Still, I will say that the Theater Union has more strength and vitality than any other theater in America, and intellectuals will be attracted to it precisely because it appeals to the workers, not in spite of that fact. However, we are trying to get away from the crude, melodramatic form of play. In fact our new play, 'The Black Pit', is the first working class tragedy in America. It is the story of a mine worker who wishes to rise in life and does so at the expense of his fellow workers by becoming a 'stool pigeon.' He finds that success at that price is empty and his fruits turn to ashes in his mouth."

"One more question, Mr. Gordon. What do you think of the future of the workers' theater in America? Do you think there will be an over whelming response?"

The director smiled. "The best answer I can give to that is this little anecdote.

"Recently, a worker from a Finnish club came to the Theater Union to get a benefit for his organization. There was a large number of people in the office and the secretary kept him waiting. Finally, when she came to him she said, 'I'm sorry to have kept you waiting. I will see you in five minutes.' 'That's all right', the worker explained, 'I've been waiting fifteen years for this theater, and I can wait another few minutes.' "

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